Miss a couple days here and you miss a lot!!
Hope everyone had a great Labor Day!
Hope everyone had a great Labor Day!
Interesting.....
- Thread starter Hilditch
- Start date
So, I see there have been some exciting posts in my absence. 
As the owner of this 'positive' forum I think I'll clarify a few points:
1) This site is not operated by Camp-Inn - this is why it is called "unofficial". It means that it is not moderated, owned, operated, paid for, edited or censored by Camp-Inn. (Calling it unathorized is just a tad too much, though, because I did get CI's permission before starting the site )
2) In an effort to add value and credibility to the site, I created an "Official Camp-Inn Area" for official announcements from Camp Inn. Naturally, this area would have to be run by Camp-Inn or else it could not be "official". Betsey accepted my offer to moderate this area, but in the other 22 areas is a mere mortal like everyone else (except for me, I alone have uber-God powers - haha
) - Oh, and I just recently promoted mega-chef George to moderator of the Cooking Area, although neither he nor I have any idea what his new duties are...
3) As this site is less than a year old, and was chiefly created to assist wannabees and gonnabees in their informed purchases, I am not at all surprised by the lack of two year+ owners. I suspect that most "experienced" CI owners are not the ones googling "Camp-Inn" and finding this forum. For the most part our users consist of Google-friendly potential owners, new owners sent here by Camp-Inn, and a few web-saavy original owners who found it on their own. Like Hilditch, I would also like to see more owners of the older Camp-Inns on this site, (take Ron&Olga, for example, who after 30+ years in a teardrop simply list their Outings/Nights in a Tear as "100s", but I suspect are too busy camping to be a regular posters), but I don't think their absence is due to a cover-up by Camp-Inn. After all, this site is listed in a prominent place on their home page, and Betsey previously made plans with me to send out an e-invite to pre-2010 owners once her busy schedule recovers from the Camp-Inn Camp-Out.
4) It is not my policy to delete out of hand a post that is not "highly skewed on the up, positive side" regarding Camp-Inn. Hilditch, you need have no worries about whether or not your post will "stick". However, please remember that just as you are free to post an opinion, other members are also free to post their feedback - even if uninvited. This behavior is typical of internet forums.
5) With all of the above explanations for how this board operates, it seemed like a good time to quote the following board rule:
In the meantime, let's do as much camping as possible (we're at 52 nights in less than a year), and even if no more experienced Camp-Inn owners join us, at least in 2 or 3 years we will all qualify.
As the owner of this 'positive' forum I think I'll clarify a few points:
1) This site is not operated by Camp-Inn - this is why it is called "unofficial". It means that it is not moderated, owned, operated, paid for, edited or censored by Camp-Inn. (Calling it unathorized is just a tad too much, though, because I did get CI's permission before starting the site
)2) In an effort to add value and credibility to the site, I created an "Official Camp-Inn Area" for official announcements from Camp Inn. Naturally, this area would have to be run by Camp-Inn or else it could not be "official". Betsey accepted my offer to moderate this area, but in the other 22 areas is a mere mortal like everyone else (except for me, I alone have uber-God powers - haha
) - Oh, and I just recently promoted mega-chef George to moderator of the Cooking Area, although neither he nor I have any idea what his new duties are...3) As this site is less than a year old, and was chiefly created to assist wannabees and gonnabees in their informed purchases, I am not at all surprised by the lack of two year+ owners. I suspect that most "experienced" CI owners are not the ones googling "Camp-Inn" and finding this forum. For the most part our users consist of Google-friendly potential owners, new owners sent here by Camp-Inn, and a few web-saavy original owners who found it on their own. Like Hilditch, I would also like to see more owners of the older Camp-Inns on this site, (take Ron&Olga, for example, who after 30+ years in a teardrop simply list their Outings/Nights in a Tear as "100s", but I suspect are too busy camping to be a regular posters), but I don't think their absence is due to a cover-up by Camp-Inn. After all, this site is listed in a prominent place on their home page, and Betsey previously made plans with me to send out an e-invite to pre-2010 owners once her busy schedule recovers from the Camp-Inn Camp-Out.
4) It is not my policy to delete out of hand a post that is not "highly skewed on the up, positive side" regarding Camp-Inn. Hilditch, you need have no worries about whether or not your post will "stick". However, please remember that just as you are free to post an opinion, other members are also free to post their feedback - even if uninvited. This behavior is typical of internet forums.
5) With all of the above explanations for how this board operates, it seemed like a good time to quote the following board rule:
So, if I do decide to censor a topic because I don't like the tone (or just because my wife's having a bad hair day), or decide to start cashing those checks from Camp-Inn (just kidding), then that's how it goes. Life's tough all over
In the meantime, let's do as much camping as possible (we're at 52 nights in less than a year), and even if no more experienced Camp-Inn owners join us, at least in 2 or 3 years we will all qualify.
George Johnson
Novice
Hilditch said:
Hilditch,
Sorry, I was camping from Friday until Monday, so I missed this post.
I'm really trying to figure out the intent of your post, considering you don't want feedback. What exactly is a forum for, if it isn't for feedback, regardless if your post is in the form of a question or a statement? By balance, do you mean you want more people to complain about the Camp-Inn's? If people don't have complaints, does that mean they should complain anyway?
Here's my list of my issues submitted to CI since I purchased my trailer:
The finish on my trailer was bad, really bad when I received it due to the plastic wrap being removed and reapplied before it shipped. But how can I complain, considering Cary offered to have it professionally buffed and send them the bill? I declined and did it myself. He wanted to reimburse me for the time. I declined again. He send me a bottle of Walbernize for free. The problem with the finish was out of Cary's control BUT they offered to fix it.
Currently, I have a buzz in my speaker system when the TV is on. If the lights are on, it gets even worse. Since I have a new TV/DVD set up, the noise feedback was a surprise to the people at CI. They have tried to reproduce the problem in the shop. Cary offered immediately to send me a replacement TV/DVD, amp and speakers. It seemed like an unnecessary expense considering the issue might be very simple. I asked Cary to hold off sending the unit until I exhausted all the possible solutions at my end first. Others would have probably taken Cary up right away. So my complaint would be??? Hmmmm, let me see... NONE!
So far, I have had nothing but superior responses from Cary and the people at CI. Am I going to find things over time that I don't like and my trailer? Probably. It's a mechanical & constructed device, problem arise. Please tell me one thing you've owned that meets every need and never has problems?
So, far, I just haven't found anything worth really complaining about. But then, when you've spent the last two years nursing a daughter back to health after being on the brink of death and you assume a parental roll with her children, you tend to see issues with a camper from an entirely different perspective. Some things in life aren't worth fretting over.
BTW, I didn't find this site until after I purchased my Camp-Inn.
Subtitle: Quality
Adcom, Griswold, Gorham, Makita, Polk, Shun, Sub-Zero and Thermador are some of the names you would find around our place. We believe in buying quality whenever we can justify it, so we bought a 2008 Camp-Inn 550 Ultra.
The design inside and out is perfect from all viewpoints. The galley is designed for an experienced cook to enjoy. The use and workmanship of the stainless and birch is beyond reproach in the galley as well as in the cabin. Nobody has the options and accessories like Camp-Inn has available. And, nobody has the reputation for quality like they do. I have never seen a photo of any tear, factory or homemade, that is any competition for the Camp-Inn.
To my dismay, there was the other side of the coin. Rather than just enjoy the tear like other high end items, we have spent over 100 hours to date just trying to keep it looking good after the first rainfall started staining the tear. Other issues called for me to be an electrician, a plumber, a roofer, an engineer, a mechanic, a front-end man, a carpenter and a mafia style negotiator for a couple of significant (read remove the body) issues. I can laugh about it now, but I’m probably the only one that had a door fall off during the first week of camping although it wasn’t very funny then. I got blindsided by this side of the coin.
After being involved with a few hundred factories and job shops during my career, it was apparent that many of the issues we experienced were due to insufficient material control and quality control capability. Unfortunately when two guys wear about 20 hats something has to give. When the workload/budget doesn’t allow for an experienced, professional person in these areas things will slip through. For now, this is part of the Camp-Inn deal even if they are pricy.
Back over on the head side: The owners of Camp-Inn care. They have worked with us to resolve our issues and stood behind their warranty. The guarantee works too! Nice guys? Hell yes. However, the important part is that they are willing to stand behind their product and correct things that were not right. This can be hard to do for both sides when we are 922 miles apart, but the willingness and attitudes were right; after a few rounds.
Here’s to a stress free next two years with the problems repaired, and Woodys.
Thank you Camp-Inn,
Hilditch & Susan
Adcom, Griswold, Gorham, Makita, Polk, Shun, Sub-Zero and Thermador are some of the names you would find around our place. We believe in buying quality whenever we can justify it, so we bought a 2008 Camp-Inn 550 Ultra.
The design inside and out is perfect from all viewpoints. The galley is designed for an experienced cook to enjoy. The use and workmanship of the stainless and birch is beyond reproach in the galley as well as in the cabin. Nobody has the options and accessories like Camp-Inn has available. And, nobody has the reputation for quality like they do. I have never seen a photo of any tear, factory or homemade, that is any competition for the Camp-Inn.
To my dismay, there was the other side of the coin. Rather than just enjoy the tear like other high end items, we have spent over 100 hours to date just trying to keep it looking good after the first rainfall started staining the tear. Other issues called for me to be an electrician, a plumber, a roofer, an engineer, a mechanic, a front-end man, a carpenter and a mafia style negotiator for a couple of significant (read remove the body) issues. I can laugh about it now, but I’m probably the only one that had a door fall off during the first week of camping although it wasn’t very funny then. I got blindsided by this side of the coin.
After being involved with a few hundred factories and job shops during my career, it was apparent that many of the issues we experienced were due to insufficient material control and quality control capability. Unfortunately when two guys wear about 20 hats something has to give. When the workload/budget doesn’t allow for an experienced, professional person in these areas things will slip through. For now, this is part of the Camp-Inn deal even if they are pricy.
Back over on the head side: The owners of Camp-Inn care. They have worked with us to resolve our issues and stood behind their warranty. The guarantee works too! Nice guys? Hell yes. However, the important part is that they are willing to stand behind their product and correct things that were not right. This can be hard to do for both sides when we are 922 miles apart, but the willingness and attitudes were right; after a few rounds.
Here’s to a stress free next two years with the problems repaired, and Woodys.
Thank you Camp-Inn,
Hilditch & Susan
George Johnson
Novice
Hilditch,
I'm not trying to make light of your concerns, in fact, I'm rather interested to know how your door fell off. I've looked at the design. The door has 24 sheet metal screws securing the piano hinge (12 on each side of the hinge). I'm not sure if Camp-Inn uses this process but in our manufacturing facility the larger pins are welded on one end and we dab the screw with a bit of silicon to lock them in. The hinge pin is captivated on both sides so it can not slide out. Did you ever figure out why/how it fell off?
Second question, why did you have to remove the body of the trailer? Is it something other Camp-Inn owners should be concerned about? This one has me really scratching my head.
I'm not trying to make light of your concerns, in fact, I'm rather interested to know how your door fell off. I've looked at the design. The door has 24 sheet metal screws securing the piano hinge (12 on each side of the hinge). I'm not sure if Camp-Inn uses this process but in our manufacturing facility the larger pins are welded on one end and we dab the screw with a bit of silicon to lock them in. The hinge pin is captivated on both sides so it can not slide out. Did you ever figure out why/how it fell off?
Second question, why did you have to remove the body of the trailer? Is it something other Camp-Inn owners should be concerned about? This one has me really scratching my head.
Cary Winch
Camp-Inn Staff
Jorge,
I got this one. The door issue was a really weird one when Hilditch's trailer was new. We found that the hinge manufacturer had over countersunk the holes for the hinges. We found the problem right away but Hilditch ended up with one that was like this on his trailer. Some of the screws pulled through the hinge holes on his right away, I thought the whole door was going to come off, it was like a zipper. We replaced his hinges with corrected ones as soon as we had them from the supplier. We forced the hinge manufacturer to change their process (much balking from them) to hold to our standard.
The frame thing was something I should not expect to see otherwise. Also a supplier issue. The axle manufacturer had improperly seated the torsion cartridge in the axle tube (they admitted this to us later and changed their process just for us). It looked and functioned perfectly when new. But, after a little bit of use the torsion cartridge shifted in the axle tube and moved the wheel all the way in to the point it rubbed on the body of the trailer. Pretty bad, the only fix was to put a new axle in it. This is why the frame had to be pulled, so the frame could have the axle cut out, replaced, frame sandblasted and repainted. The part that kills me is we use the highest end torsion axle on the market. I guess I should be happy we have only seen one axle issue in our entire history because we use the best axles but I would prefer to have no seen any.
This all just goes to show the importance of having a warranty and standing by it. Even when you build the highest quality and set a high standard of inspection things like this can happen, Murphy is everywhere of course.
Cary
I got this one. The door issue was a really weird one when Hilditch's trailer was new. We found that the hinge manufacturer had over countersunk the holes for the hinges. We found the problem right away but Hilditch ended up with one that was like this on his trailer. Some of the screws pulled through the hinge holes on his right away, I thought the whole door was going to come off, it was like a zipper. We replaced his hinges with corrected ones as soon as we had them from the supplier. We forced the hinge manufacturer to change their process (much balking from them) to hold to our standard.
The frame thing was something I should not expect to see otherwise. Also a supplier issue. The axle manufacturer had improperly seated the torsion cartridge in the axle tube (they admitted this to us later and changed their process just for us). It looked and functioned perfectly when new. But, after a little bit of use the torsion cartridge shifted in the axle tube and moved the wheel all the way in to the point it rubbed on the body of the trailer. Pretty bad, the only fix was to put a new axle in it. This is why the frame had to be pulled, so the frame could have the axle cut out, replaced, frame sandblasted and repainted. The part that kills me is we use the highest end torsion axle on the market. I guess I should be happy we have only seen one axle issue in our entire history because we use the best axles but I would prefer to have no seen any.
This all just goes to show the importance of having a warranty and standing by it. Even when you build the highest quality and set a high standard of inspection things like this can happen, Murphy is everywhere of course.
Cary
Hi all,
I had no intension on elaborating on the above, but after reading Cary’s response about the door, which is true, I feel like it didn’t do the story justice. It wasn’t quite as cut & dried for us.
After not camping for 30 years we picked up the tear at Camp-Inn. On night two our 12’ x 12’ canopy came crashing down on the tear at 3:00 AM during a heavy thunderstorm as it didn’t like holding up a few hundred pounds of water. Scratched the new tear and got us off to a great start.
On the morning of day 4 we bought another 12’ x 12’ canopy before leaving Wisconsin. We drove through Minnesota, crossed over into Canada, got through Thunder Bay and got to our campsite at Sleeping Giant Provincial Park a little after 8:00 PM. A 400 plus mile day; leaving Thunder Bay 65 miles behind us. It was cloudy, getting dark, very cool and windy with a light rain.
We set up the canopy. It was a 10’ X 10’ straight leg that came in a box that said 12’ x 12’ straight leg. The store was one country and 350 miles behind. Not happy.
Before getting in, I decided to take the cabin light apart that had been flickering to try & fix it. I was sitting in the doorway with my feet on the ground when a gust of wind decided to close the door. Well, my knees were in the way so it slammed my knees and proceeded to peel off the side of the tear. It hurt!
As we had bought a Camp-Inn, of course I didn’t pack duck tape, which we now carry. I know, stupid. Now I needed 12 little washers the exact right size to hold the door hinge on. Didn’t pack them either. So we went on our 2 ½ hour round trip – another 130 miles in the dark rain to luckily find a big box still open in Thunder Bay that had the washers I needed.
Reattached the door in the rain, took a shower and crashed. The light had a bad socket. Suppliers fault also. Cary sent a new one. Sometimes warranty issues create a lot more trouble for the customer that it first appears.
Ninety percent of our issues have been the suppliers fault.
Interesting.
Hilditch
I had no intension on elaborating on the above, but after reading Cary’s response about the door, which is true, I feel like it didn’t do the story justice. It wasn’t quite as cut & dried for us.
After not camping for 30 years we picked up the tear at Camp-Inn. On night two our 12’ x 12’ canopy came crashing down on the tear at 3:00 AM during a heavy thunderstorm as it didn’t like holding up a few hundred pounds of water. Scratched the new tear and got us off to a great start.
On the morning of day 4 we bought another 12’ x 12’ canopy before leaving Wisconsin. We drove through Minnesota, crossed over into Canada, got through Thunder Bay and got to our campsite at Sleeping Giant Provincial Park a little after 8:00 PM. A 400 plus mile day; leaving Thunder Bay 65 miles behind us. It was cloudy, getting dark, very cool and windy with a light rain.
We set up the canopy. It was a 10’ X 10’ straight leg that came in a box that said 12’ x 12’ straight leg. The store was one country and 350 miles behind. Not happy.
Before getting in, I decided to take the cabin light apart that had been flickering to try & fix it. I was sitting in the doorway with my feet on the ground when a gust of wind decided to close the door. Well, my knees were in the way so it slammed my knees and proceeded to peel off the side of the tear. It hurt!
As we had bought a Camp-Inn, of course I didn’t pack duck tape, which we now carry. I know, stupid. Now I needed 12 little washers the exact right size to hold the door hinge on. Didn’t pack them either. So we went on our 2 ½ hour round trip – another 130 miles in the dark rain to luckily find a big box still open in Thunder Bay that had the washers I needed.
Reattached the door in the rain, took a shower and crashed. The light had a bad socket. Suppliers fault also. Cary sent a new one. Sometimes warranty issues create a lot more trouble for the customer that it first appears.
Ninety percent of our issues have been the suppliers fault.
Interesting.
Hilditch
George Johnson
Novice
This thread started out a bit rocky but I am very impressed with the dialogue. Hilditch has remained civil yet informative about his trailer issues.
Cary's response could have been defensive because Camp-Inn's name wasn't getting the best publicity. He explained that there were problems and remained professional. I respect that a lot.
I've learned that the people at Camp-Inn do everything in their power to make things right. At first read, I thought Hilditch was just complaining because he had grievances. Based on his responses, I have a new respect for him.
Because of this thread, I think it's fairly clear that this forum is in no way an extension of the Camp-Inn corporation. It's safer to assume, the people who own Camp-Inn's love their trailers and are generally positive people.
Last, I'm really glad my first trip out wasn't like Hilditch's. I might of just left it along side the road with a "free - you haul" sign hanging off it.
Cary's response could have been defensive because Camp-Inn's name wasn't getting the best publicity. He explained that there were problems and remained professional. I respect that a lot.
I've learned that the people at Camp-Inn do everything in their power to make things right. At first read, I thought Hilditch was just complaining because he had grievances. Based on his responses, I have a new respect for him.
Because of this thread, I think it's fairly clear that this forum is in no way an extension of the Camp-Inn corporation. It's safer to assume, the people who own Camp-Inn's love their trailers and are generally positive people.
Last, I'm really glad my first trip out wasn't like Hilditch's. I might of just left it along side the road with a "free - you haul" sign hanging off it.
Although he doesn't know it, Hilditch's was the very first Camp-Inn I ever saw. It's those very cool and distinctive streaks on the side that gave it away.
I was pulling into a rest stop in I35 south of Necedah last month on my way to pick up my new 560 when, lo, in front of me also pulling off was a Camp-Inn. Initially knew that because of the Camp-Inn styled back bumper. Turns out it was a gentleman from Florida who had worked for Camp-Inn some time back and was retrieving Hilditch's trailer from Georgia for that axle work Hilditch mentioned. "Bent axle" was what the gentleman told me, a description since corrected/elaborated by Hilditch and Cary above. It was sitting there in the Necedah shop when I arrived the next morning.
Yep, I bought my Camp-Inn 560 without ever having seen one -- On the strength of many, many hours searching the web and reading owners' praises. Hilditch's was the first I ever saw in person.
So thanks, Hilditch.
I was pulling into a rest stop in I35 south of Necedah last month on my way to pick up my new 560 when, lo, in front of me also pulling off was a Camp-Inn. Initially knew that because of the Camp-Inn styled back bumper. Turns out it was a gentleman from Florida who had worked for Camp-Inn some time back and was retrieving Hilditch's trailer from Georgia for that axle work Hilditch mentioned. "Bent axle" was what the gentleman told me, a description since corrected/elaborated by Hilditch and Cary above. It was sitting there in the Necedah shop when I arrived the next morning.
Yep, I bought my Camp-Inn 560 without ever having seen one -- On the strength of many, many hours searching the web and reading owners' praises. Hilditch's was the first I ever saw in person.
So thanks, Hilditch.
Steve & Ellen
Novice
This has been a great thread. The best so far. Sometimes "if it weren't for bad luck there would be not luck at all. Gloom despair and agony on me" This is from 25 years of HEE-HAW.
Steve
Steve