External Solar Advice Needed

K

Kevin Ensign

Novice
With the holiday season / sales coming I want to be ready.

Have been staying at a lot of rustic sites / campgrounds where no shore hook up is available; are preference fewer people. Usually we are in a conopy of trees that prevents our roof top OEM solar from fully being utilized. We keep the Dometic as a freezer and it puts a strain on the battery, not to mention my wife loves to keep the roof fan on at night. Also with the awning out part of it can block some of the roof top. Looking to add to our arsenal and utilize the factory exteriro port and at the same time keeping our options open for a complete SO-Gen system. Bottom line I want to keep the battery full! This will be used strictly for our 560 adventures.

A 200watt suitcase style is on our radar in addition to a few different lengths of cord.
I’m open to any guidance, input, or suggestions. Thank you in advance.

2022 560 Ultra
AGM Battery
Rooftop Solar (includes CTEK battery charger/controller)
 
I don’t have rooftop solar or a refrigerator, but CPAP usage has kept my focus on off-grid charging.

My non-stock components are:
A renogy 100w suitcase panel, with its AGM/lithium capable charger. That panel charger can be used with my;
lithium 60ah “pony” battery, dedicated to CPAP, though I could power the CI with it (via HD cigarette lighter extension)
A shore power charger for the pony battery. It and the battery usually live in the headboard cabinet.
A 100ah replacement AGM battery in the CI (the next one will be lithium).
A CTEK 12v/12v charger for alternator and solar charging. (Bypass the panel’s charger when charging the trailer via the CTEK).

The panel can be set in a sunny spot with the pony battery away from the trailer, because we too camp in the shade, mostly.

The panel can be connected to the CI solar input up to 20 feet away via extension cable. It’s hard to get much further away because you need a substantial cable gauge due to voltage drop over distance, though the CTEK does help with that.

Note that eg. a 100ah AGM should not be discharged past about 40% capacity, depending on specifics, while a 100ah lithium is good to perhaps 10% capacity. That’s a big difference! About 30ah of usable power… though you’d better add monitoring and keep track!

In need, the car can idle for alternator charging. Beware of “smart” alternators that may not support charging at idle.

Those are my strategies, I’ve found this setup to be pretty versatile… yours probably a little different, but it sounds like both of us are in the shade, mostly.

My nuclear option would be to get an awfully darn quiet generator and convert it to propane, using a 20Lb tank on the tongue.
 
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Kevin Ensign said:
With the holiday season / sales coming I want to be ready.

Have been staying at a lot of rustic sites / campgrounds where no shore hook up is available; are preference fewer people. Usually we are in a conopy of trees that prevents our roof top OEM solar from fully being utilized. We keep the Dometic as a freezer and it puts a strain on the battery, not to mention my wife loves to keep the roof fan on at night. Also with the awning out part of it can block some of the roof top. Looking to add to our arsenal and utilize the factory exteriro port and at the same time keeping our options open for a complete SO-Gen system. Bottom line I want to keep the battery full! This will be used strictly for our 560 adventures.

A 200watt suitcase style is on our radar in addition to a few different lengths of cord.
I’m open to any guidance, input, or suggestions. Thank you in advance.

2022 560 Ultra
AGM Battery
Rooftop Solar (includes CTEK battery charger/controller)
Click to expand...
@Kevin Ensign good thinking, I am watching sales too.

In the meantime, to your question:
you'll find a LOT of discussion here if you play with the search feature. I like to camp like you and have been experimenting a bit.
TLDR: "it depends"...:)

1. There are several users here who comment on how to calculate your electrical needs, see @rotus8 iirc and a simpler way is just look at the graphics on some of the most popular recent brands and deals.
See @JohnC posts for example on Ecolabs. He's the guru on that!
 
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Personally, I'm keeping an eye on EcoLab sales on their website and Amazon...
Prices have come down so far in last 5 years, and careful shopping for the connections you need for Dometic and panels is key.

How much watts in panels is a function of how much battery needed in Sogen, charged how fast...your latitude, how often you "groom" the panels to be pointed at sun.

Which is a function of how much power you need...I have an older approx 1000wh capacity sogen that gets drained freezing water bottles in Dometic overnight,

and if I were to combine the fan used all night in desert, and Dometic in freeze mode connected to CI battery, it accelerates that.

I have an older and smaller 400wh sogen that runs my CPAP 3 days without water tank heating.

The 126w solar roof panels I had back-fitted to my old 560 at the nest keep the flooded cell, AGM, or Lion bat-tree as house battery in CI recharge and top off nicely when driving down the road using the CTEK as solar controller/alternator power to charge.

On one long 3000 mile trip with sunny days I experimented a lot and that roof solar plus alternator kept the Dometic stashed in CI cabin cool, the house battery charged, along with recharging the 400ah via a DC port.

The newer 1000ah sogen I got from the same company that made the Precision battery, as its first sogen model just before they were bought out by a bigger company...

It was ok, but not as capable as newer competitors and not quite enough POWAH...

So now I'm thinking the Ecolab Delta3 Max Plus...twice the capacity, extra features, inc Anderson outputs so I dont have to use the cigarette plug to charge tge Dometic...that wobbles around and is less efficient...robs power.

Anyway...way too much info here, sorry!

---
Just another example of how fast this solar and lion tech is evolving and why you should follow CampInns careful lead IMHO on whatever you put in the teardrop...

Ans then experiment with extra as part of a separate system- panels, sogen, that run Dometic in the TV...

Its just easier in my view and you can update faster easier than trying to combine things.

And you can add more later as the tech improves and prices drop.

But...like I said: "it depends"
There are some seriously briliiant people in these forums, some moved on, but all their advice is highly useful if you read back a bit.

I have come to the conclusion like several- the best combo is carry Dometic in TV, with extra sogen there powering it.
How you charge it is next question. In my experience a 1000wh sogen needs minimum 200w solar and thats in full sun, repositioned 2-3 times a day to be perpendicular to the sun...tilted and aimed as it crosses the sky.
So you spend some time in camp managing it. Leaving it out un-looked after encourages sticky fingers...

Then there is the question of how to recharge/power the sogen and your CI battery on cloudy or rainy days...no hookups...

See @David Rossiter posts who has done a couple of Trans Canada trips and brings along a small generator like this:

David was an early adopter on the CI lion battree and knows a lot about the AC charger and shunt needed if your CampInn doesnt have that already.

That gasoline generator is quiet, CA CARB compliant, comparable in price to a 2000ah sogen, and will fast charge that AND your CI house battree too...

So you may go that way too in your dispersed camping...
 
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One thing you can do with a fully charged power station that comes with a 12v cig port is connect it directly to a 12v cig port on the camper via a male-to-male cable. If you’re considering this one BIG note of caution: turn the battery isolator switch OFF on the camper before you connect the power station.

Easy way to utilize the advantages of LI that holds up for extended stays or when it’s cloudy out, your onboard battery is low, and too windy for putting a panel out.
 
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J

Thread 'About those solar generators'

I probably have more of them than I need. But it's Black Friday and I'm sitting in front of a computer. What could possibly go wrong??? LoL!

Last year about this time I bought a 1KWh Ecoflow Delta3 Plus for $600 which was a good deal. I used it this year and it works great. This year I didn't really think I needed another one but it's always interesting to see what's on the market.

Turns out Anker just released the 1KWh Solix C1000 Gen 2. Very similar to the my current Delt3 Plus. But currently on sale for $349. Well, turns out I now have one on the way, due here on Friday.

I'll just...
  • Like

In that thread I bought the Anker2000, after this last summer I have no problems with the setup. We had 4-5 days of no hook ups, keeping the fridge running is the main power drain. The Anker will keep fridge running for at least four days without charge. The camper power drain is very minimal running lights and fan. With the solar on the camper I have not seen it drop below 80. After 4 days the Anker will go from 100 to the 20’s. Plugging the fridge in the camper would give me at least another couple days.
 
I think we can be placed in the pwr hog user bucket!!
This is also what I am thinking "carry Dometic in TV, with extra sogen there powering it." I believe we can go 10 days if the Dometic is not part of the trailer power source.

I've read / searced some; guess one thread of a member damaging his trailer has me gun shy on how big and what mfg.
thanks
 
I should add that I have the Lithium battery in the CI.

With the setup now I think I could go 10. If we travel from the campsite I can recharge the Anker with the fridge plugged into it. And Yes fan must run at night:)
 
This is what I'm looking at thus far. Just need to make sure I'm comparing apples to apples.

Assuming when you purchase a system I will also be able to hook up the pannels to charge the camper system?

Jackery Explorer =$630
offgridstores.com

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EcoFlow River 2 Pro = $560

buildthepower.com

EcoFlow RIVER 2 Pro + 1*220W Portable Solar PanelDefault Title

EcoFlow RIVER 2 Pro + 220W solar panel delivers fast, reliable off-grid power—ideal for camping, home backup, and outdoor adventures.
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Anker SOLIX C1000=$400 + shipping
www.construcs.promo

Anker SOLIX C1000 Gen2 2000W 1024Wh Portable Power Station

Anker SOLIX C1000 Gen 2 The Fastest Recharging Portable Power Station (1 kwh) Stay Ahead of Any Outage 100% in 49 Min Refrigerator (100W) CPAP Machine (40W) Kettle (1,000W) Note: The average outage lasts 12 hours, three times longer than the safe limits of foods, according to the FDA and other...
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Well, I had this all ready to post last night when the forum went down. Let me try again…

I have a similar setup with a 560 with rooftop solar and the AGM battery. I seldom camp with shore power. But I do try and find campsites with good visibility to the sky. Occasionally you still run into some gloomy days and some sunny days with dappled light.

I’ve found the rooftop solar works quite well with dappled light and often I still get enough charge to keep the fridge going and not run down the battery. However, a few times I’ve been concerned I’ve managed to use one of my smaller Ecoflow sogens to power the fridge overnight or even during the day. The key being that they will fit in the galley with the lid closed. The beauty of that is that I can easily recharge the sogen during the day by plugging it into the car while I’m out.

I originally thought about running solar panels to the external charging port on the 560. However, after a few trips I realized that the length of extension needed was probably going to make the idea questionable as to how much power you would get and how long it might take to complete the charge. I don’t want to be sitting around all day babysitting the solar gear.

Now all of this does assume that you can still draw some power thru your rooftop and that your fridge is your biggest power drain, which is my situation. Over 5 years my original AGM battery still seems to be holding up fine. But I do also keep it plugged in in the garage when home.
 
Carl U said:
J

Thread 'About those solar generators'

I probably have more of them than I need. But it's Black Friday and I'm sitting in front of a computer. What could possibly go wrong??? LoL!

Last year about this time I bought a 1KWh Ecoflow Delta3 Plus for $600 which was a good deal. I used it this year and it works great. This year I didn't really think I needed another one but it's always interesting to see what's on the market.

Turns out Anker just released the 1KWh Solix C1000 Gen 2. Very similar to the my current Delt3 Plus. But currently on sale for $349. Well, turns out I now have one on the way, due here on Friday.

I'll just...
  • Like

In that thread I bought the Anker2000, after this last summer I have no problems with the setup. We had 4-5 days of no hook ups, keeping the fridge running is the main power drain. The Anker will keep fridge running for at least four days without charge. The camper power drain is very minimal running lights and fan. With the solar on the camper I have not seen it drop below 80. After 4 days the Anker will go from 100 to the 20’s. Plugging the fridge in the camper would give me at least another couple days.
Click to expand...
I've come to the conclusion for dispersed camping that in general the best sogen with panel combo stowed in Tow vehicle is 2000wh capacity and 200-400w panels foldable, if you are a power hog like me.
I'm thinking about the mini Starlink which is a power suck, and recharging a laptop if I do work on the road. Maybe a drone...see how this goes...?
MUST HAVE POWAH!!!

Seriously want to be able to run my fridge at least 3-4 days minimum, esp if its 100% by day a frosty beer at nite is delightful...

and if you are making ice, especially in hot desert, you need to recharge almost daily in full sun. And at 1000wh and 200 w panels you are stuck in camp futzing too much.

If its raining or cloudy you need another source of power- alternator charging which means pickup for the bigger alternator charger that Ecolab sells.

Running another load in addition to the CTEK alternator charging the CI battery is a non starter in my itty bitty VW Golf Sportwagon wannabe Subaru...see how convoluted this gets...;)

Otherwise you are just driving to town almost daily. And then you might as well be at the KOA then...

If you keep it simple the rooftop and lion combo in the Campinn is plenty. Again, I'd refer to @JohnC and a couple others who have more actual camping with sogens for a good range of ideas.

Then pick something easy- panels bundled with sogen spares you making up cables to match connectors and gets you out camoing fastest, which is the point really.

I do look forward to some trip reports on the new Ecolab fridge/freezers that CI sells now vs the Dometic...

And the hot tub option...

Remember...its Glamping.
Standards must be maintained.
We arent sleeping on thermorest pads on the ground anymore, living on cheese and salami and cheap wine in the bota bag...;)
 
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Let me post this here regarding solar panels. Last holiday season I bought the linked 350W panel. It uses a newer type of technology with N type cells and 16 busbars. Now I don't claim to understand all the technology involved but my understanding is that the 16 busbar connections help it draw power better while partially shaded.

There are YouTube reviews out there that are very impressive which led me to buy them now that I have some larger sogens. While I've only tested them at home, I can confirm they are much more efficient than the older portable panels and they absolutely will work quite well even with tree branches throwing shade across the panels. I got as good or better efficiency from them as I did with my 100W glass panel. Which means you will charge a lot quicker than with any of the other "portable" panels. Their only drawback is they are a bit larger to carry.


 
JohnC said:
Let me post this here regarding solar panels. Last holiday season I bought the linked 350W panel. It uses a newer type of technology with N type cells and 16 busbars. Now I don't claim to understand all the technology involved but my understanding is that the 16 busbar connections help it draw power better while partially shaded.

There are YouTube reviews out there that are very impressive which led me to buy them now that I have some larger sogens. While I've only tested them at home, I can confirm they are much more efficient than the older portable panels and they absolutely will work quite well even with tree branches throwing shade across the panels. I got as good or better efficiency from them as I did with my 100W glass panel. Which means you will charge a lot quicker than with any of the other "portable" panels. Their only drawback is they are a bit larger to carry.


Click to expand...
Thanks @JohnC damn you for getting me hooked...;)


My precious...
J/k

Just another example how fast the tech is evolving. A handy fold up almost 400w solution for what a decent 100w panel cost 4 years ago. I can easily replace my old two folders of 100 each to make room for this.
IP68 waterproof is important, also.

Looking forward to how it works on the road...with your latest Ecolabs.

PS what advantage of the 350 watt folder vs the 400w panel bundle deal st Ecolab?

Black Friday is coming...
 
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The Postman said:
Thanks @JohnC damn you for getting me hooked...;)


My precious...
J/k

Just another example how fast the tech is evolving. A handy fold up almost 400w solution for what a decent 100w panel cost 4 years ago. I can easily replace my old two folders of 100 each to make room for this.
IP68 waterproof is important, also.

Looking forward to how it works on the road...with your latest Ecolabs.

PS what advantage of the 350 watt folder vs the 400w panel bundle deal st Ecolab?

Black Friday is coming...
Click to expand...
I don't really keep up with this stuff until I'm in the market. I have an EcoFlow Delta 3 Classic and a Delta 3 Plus. Both a 1K in size. That's the sweet spot for me as far as weight/portability and power capacity. Those are what I used at home to test the Zoup 350. I also tested the panels on my little River 3s. They all worked great.

Unless Ecoflow has changed, their panels are comparable to most of the portable panels out there but they do not have the newer technology used in the Zoup panels. But that stuff is always changing so I would suggest anybody do some current research to confirm if any of that has changed.

These are all Chinese companies making this stuff so you really have to do your homework. Companies come and go quickly. When I bought the Zoup panel about a year ago, there were a couple of other brands advertising the same technology. But Zoup had a few youtubers demoing them which gave me the confidence to try buying them. If I can't find anything about a company I usually pass.

Here's a couple of reviews but again, I urge people to do their own research to decide what works best for them.


 
Thanks @JohnC
I too do not pretend to be an expert and do my homework pretty much like you.
Then I experiment on the road, trying this and that.

There are some people on the innertubes who talk about how to verify the claims of efficiency in one panel vs another, but I dont have tools, knowledge or desire to try to replicate that. The thing to remember is the charging times or other power numbers claimed by manufacurer are based on being at the equator, sun over head, at noon...clear skies. You wont get that camping in the woods in winter in Maine sweeping snow off panels...and everyone hooks up different things, so there is gonna be some "try it out and see what works."

I believe the solar panels on the rooftop option are capable of charging in part shade...they do on mine sitting in an RV lot, part shade during the day, and with the victron shunt I can see when the sun passes by the volts/current in history diagram on the BT app on iphone.

Exactly how much efficiency is a Cary question but I recall they were pretty high tech at the time I got mine backfitted at The Nest. I'm pretty sure I was getting juice with the panels covered with light translucent tent fabric...my screened tent roof snugged in close one time for cooking in the rain in FL piney woods,

But I didnt have the Trimex ( with its shunt) to measure current so I could only go by the charging lights on galley interior panel.
And a simple voltage indicator plugged into the cigarette plug beneath it.

@Kevin Ensign you asked about plugging external panels into the Campinn side port: yes, you can and depending on the CTEK and rooftop solar panels installed the CTEK can handle more but thats a "check the manual" and then call Cary for how much in addition as the solar controller function of the CTEK has a limit.

Some Campinns were sold with external port but no rooftop panels to allow folks to buy exterior panels and charge the Campinn house battery. In that case you need to ask Cary/Craig whats in your build. You may need to buy solar panels with solar controller included or a separate one to manage the DC current going to battery, if there is not one in the CI.

Btw on the PITA of connecting things with different type solar cable ends...you can make up your own pigtail adapter for almost anything, inc to plug into the Marinco type input on Campinn, to adapt to the connection type on the panel...Anderson, MC4, Zamp, whatever. You need a couple tools and there I leave further comment to @Sweeney or others who have done so. Or clips on youtube. I've made up some cables with MC4 connectors, using a wire striiping, clamping tool and even soldered some...woot!
Not expensive or hard to find on Amazon.

Or, Sometimes you can find pre-made pigtails already made up on Amazon,
or extension cables premade that you might buy to put the solar panels further out in the sun while CampInn is in the shade.

There was a really good youtube about 3 yrs ago by some old guy in Oz, who was big on minimizing the number of connectors, which create som resistance and pointed out the length of solar cable and type has resistance...and was adamant that cigarrette lighter types are the worst...

Well, ok so if you want to put more secure connectors or choose sogens that put DC power out in Anderson or other types in addition to cigarrete plugs, you can shop for that too. The cigarette plug on my Dometic is sort of fragile and gets loose or broken if I am rattling along a USFS fire road, and forget to strap the Dometic down good......

Ask Cary on the Marinco port connector. These come from marine tech for waterproof toughness common to trolling motors.
There have been many Campinns made with no roortop but a cable connector on the side. Cary and Craig can confirm whats in there by the build number. I think they sell already made up connectors or cables.

Thats all I can think of...sorry to run on there, but maybe helpful for others new or lurking thinking about a new or used Campinn.
They are built thinking ahead designed by a couple of electrical engineers constantly improving, for a lot of flexibility...carefully and so you can add or mod as you go if your needs change, with a little bit of homework.
 
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The Postman said:
Btw on the PITA of connecting things with different type solar cable ends...you can make up your own pigtail adapter for almost anything, inc to plug into the Marinco type input on Campinn, to adapt to the connection type on the panel...Anderson, MC4, Zamp, whatever. You need a couple tools and there I leave further comment to @Sweeney or others who have done so. Or clips on youtube.

Sometimes you can find pre-made pigtails already made up on Amazon,
or extension cables that you might buy to put the solar panels out in the sun while CampInn is in the shade.

Ask Cary on the Marinco port connector. These come from marine tech for waterproof toughness common to trolling motors.
There have been many Campinns made with no roortop but a cable connector on the side. Cary and Craig can confirm whats in there by the build number.
Click to expand...
An MC4-to-Marico 3-prong recepticle from the factory would be awesome. I wish they sold them. I don't trust me to make one myself.
 
Kevin Ensign said:
With the holiday season / sales coming I want to be ready.

Have been staying at a lot of rustic sites / campgrounds where no shore hook up is available; are preference fewer people. Usually we are in a conopy of trees that prevents our roof top OEM solar from fully being utilized. We keep the Dometic as a freezer and it puts a strain on the battery, not to mention my wife loves to keep the roof fan on at night. Also with the awning out part of it can block some of the roof top. Looking to add to our arsenal and utilize the factory exteriro port and at the same time keeping our options open for a complete SO-Gen system. Bottom line I want to keep the battery full! This will be used strictly for our 560 adventures.

A 200watt suitcase style is on our radar in addition to a few different lengths of cord.
I’m open to any guidance, input, or suggestions. Thank you in advance.

2022 560 Ultra
AGM Battery
Rooftop Solar (includes CTEK battery charger/controller)
Click to expand...
I’ve had and used the 200W and 100W Renogy solar suitcase. I have a 25ft cable so
I can get the panels out in the sun. I went from the 100W to the 200W when I got the dometic refrigerator. I also installed a 110 aH LiPo battery. Bottom line is the 200W panel is not really adequate for maintaining charge equilibrium. Speaking from vague memory, I found I was using 12-14aH every 24 hours. When running the fridge, lights, etc. the fridge is the major draw. The other stuff is minimal In comparison. The 200W would give me maybe maybe 8-10 aH on a really sunny day.

The other more important drawback for the 200w is its big and really heavy. I think there are newer flexible panels that are lighter and more Managable with similar output. Other variables in your favor is Cooler temps winter camping will require fewer aH to run you’re freezer. I also keep the refrigerator in my vehicle when I am out and about. Or traveling. If you keep it in the galley it will constantly short cycle which uses more amps and is harder on the unit.

I also have a 2000 watt Yamaha inverter which I bring on my trips. To run my ac. I’ve found that running the inverter for a couple hours gets me more than enough charging (I have a 15amp Victron charger).

I sold my 2020 560 and bought a new 2026 560this summer that has the OEM roof solar. Haven’t really tested it yet. But with a 110 aH LiPo battery I can theoretically go for about 4-5 days without charging. The 15
Amp charger and the CTEK (20 amp) with the LiPo battery allows me to put 15-20aH in the battery with an hour of charging. Given
my 24 hour usage of 14-15 aH, I don’t really need solar.

My strong recommendation is that you convert to a LiPo system. I did it on my 2020 560. It’s not that hard or complicated. Trying to run a refrigerator or freezer on an AGM is going to be a constant challenge anyway. You’ll be having to deal with charging (solar or inverter every day. That assume you’re boondocking like I do often.
 
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I have often found trying to get electric campsites is often almost impossible. Having the Anker I can confidently find a non electric campsite. Last year Black Friday deal for the upgrade from 1000 to 2000 and the price difference was around 2-300.
 
Carl U said:
J

Thread 'About those solar generators'

I probably have more of them than I need. But it's Black Friday and I'm sitting in front of a computer. What could possibly go wrong??? LoL!

Last year about this time I bought a 1KWh Ecoflow Delta3 Plus for $600 which was a good deal. I used it this year and it works great. This year I didn't really think I needed another one but it's always interesting to see what's on the market.

Turns out Anker just released the 1KWh Solix C1000 Gen 2. Very similar to the my current Delt3 Plus. But currently on sale for $349. Well, turns out I now have one on the way, due here on Friday.

I'll just...
  • Like

In that thread I bought the Anker2000, after this last summer I have no problems with the setup. We had 4-5 days of no hook ups, keeping the fridge running is the main power drain. The Anker will keep fridge running for at least four days without charge. The camper power drain is very minimal running lights and fan. With the solar on the camper I have not seen it drop below 80. After 4 days the Anker will go from 100 to the 20’s. Plugging the fridge in the camper would give me at least another couple days.
Click to expand...
That's what I'm looking for right there. Also eyeing the Anker 2000.
 
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